The Artilect War: Will AI Be the Death of Us? with Dr. Hugo de Garis

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1. Mmmmm ….tasty food for my brain. Much needed. Much appreciated.

2. Interesting Professional Development course selections at Stanford:
   http://scpd.stanford.edu/programs/professional-education

   http://scpd.stanford.edu/search/publicCourseAdvancedSearch.do?courseSearch.interestAreaStringArray=83308320&courseSearch.filterString=all&method=searchNoCN&cspIndex=true&showInternal=false&courseSearch.filterString=&searchType=advanced&isPageDisplayed=true&courseSearch.courseDescriptionKeyword=&courseSearch.sectionSemesterIdString=82087020&courseSearch.deliveryMethodString=&courseSearch.courseCategoryStringArray=11206&mkt_tok=eyJpIjoiWTJabVltSTFORFZoTkRoaCIsInQiOiJhVVRaUTNxYjVcL0tySWhuVXNsRjNpZjRSQ3duSjFVOE5uZTNxZ00xTmtFR1RKNmRkTkZmbEhnN2xocnoyQ3YyUTRKcnBjWVdZWHNVZFBCeGZuQWprVk1oRUhRcXJCeU1ucEwxSUM3ZHZYV1JPUEFsdmJNZXhPZTJFVmJaQUpSRVgifQ%3D%3D#searchResults

3. Late to this party, but I wanted to drop a comment on the interview style – I thought the beginning through the middle of the questions that Harry posed were excellent. However, after about the midway point, Harry began to lecture Dr. de Garis. I was disappointed in this approach. Even though I disagree with several of Dr. de Garis’s premises and conclusions , I wanted to know more about his thoughts on the upcoming AI tsunami.

   The thought, I believe is attributed to Aristotle – intelligence is the ability to maintain two paradoxical ideas at the same time without blowing up – came to mind several times during the latter part of this interview. There is no need, imo of course, to try to convert the guests to your point of view. Enable your guests to completely flesh their ideas out.

   Groupthink is a danger for all viewpoints and groups, the Solari group is not an exception. I think we are best served by avoiding recourse to the need to state positions that everyone here (likely) agrees with.

   1. Good point about the dangers of groupthink…!

      Now even later to this party — regarding “the ability to maintain two paradoxical ideas at the same time” (under *any* conditions), I perceive that Harry Blazer knew *exactly* what he was doing when he asked, “Is it possible for AI to be irrational or illogical?”

      And with the response, “Oh God! Now you are asking me Gödel type questions. That’s a really tough question. I think I’ll pass,” I fear that Dr. Hugo de Garis summarily dismissed himself from any serious consideration as a sincere/principled “brain-builder” or “Brain Architect” — at least in the view of any genuinely qualified mathematician I can think of. (For those unfamiliar with Gödel’s theorems, they deal with mathematical inconsistency, or paradox.)

      I mean, by now (May2023) even casual AI users/consumers know about the irrational/illogical/paradoxical phenomenon of “AI hallucinations,” which even Dr. de Garis would understand perfectly with only casual reflection upon Gödel’s proofs, which he surely remembers from his own mathematics study and teaching.

      I sense Harry’s determined (like Kurt Gödel’s) pursuit of the Truth, and Dr. de Garis’s apparent discomfort with that — i.e., viz., the truth about the future reality we are choosing/creating/building for our posterity…

      However — happily for Dr. de Garis, and very much to his credit — Harry’s unrelenting masterful “lecture” eventually elicited Dr. de Garis’s admission to his own pursuit of ultimate Truth…: “I’ve learned so much math and physics, now I’m deeply, deeply suspicious that the laws of physics […themselves…] have been engineered, because they’re so mathematical.” And finally that “I probably enjoyed […this conversation…] a lot more because, remember, I live in a cultural cocoon.”

      Yes, AI thoroughly fascinates us, but let it neither distract nor deter us from pursuing the Truth…!

4. Had the opportunity to hear Dr. Hugo de Garis give a presentation in Branson on the coming Artilect War. In person he is a remarkable man, he is animated, humorous and has passion on a very serious topic of the approaching Artilect Wars. Dr. Hugo reminds me of Professor Irwin Corey (remember him)on his delivery with a restraint matter. The 3000 people in the audience got his message. The world is about to change in a big way unless the powers decide the close the pandora box that has been pried open by technology. Can they? They were able to come up with the limited test ban treaty pledging to refrain from testing nuclear weapons in the atmosphere or in outer space when Soviet Union almost set the atmosphere on fire. Maybe an agreement can be made about curtailing the development of artificial intelligence? I would not put my hopes on seeing that happening despite Dr. Hugo believing we are in a war for the survival of our species.

   Just thinking out loud.
   Could it be that all this push for gun control the last 20 plus years has to do with disarming the humans (terrans) so not to thwart the advancement of A.I.

   Catherine, please keep in touch with this marvelous man.

   1. Will be posting a review of AI Superpowers shortly. Will strongly recommend on the topic of AI. The Chinese are going to drive forward on AI as fast as they can go. No stopping it, is what it looks like to me.

      The gun control battle is very important. However, the people fighting to protect guns have failed to grapple with mind control and invasive digital systems. This is one of the reasons we published Control 101. To get the full spectrum of citizens to look at an integrated piece.

      1. You and your members may want access to Dr. de Garis 56 slide presentation that was given in Branson Conference.
         https://profhugodegaris.wordpress.com/true-legends-conf-branson-mo-2018-ppt/

5. Harry Blazer was well prepared for this interview with Hugo de Garis. Well done. Now let’s hope that A.I. does not get it’s hands on the Chinese game of Go and read Sun Tzu’s book of The Art of War.

   1. Reading a new book that argues China has passed us in AI. More when I finish.

6. My hat is off to Harry Blazer. In the nicest way, he helped Mr. DeGaris apprehend that he’s been in an echo chamber about artificial intelligence all along. The mechanistic model is “bits of information times processing speed equals intelligence.” But we are not bit chambers with wondrous turnstiles for each bit to go through. The bits themselves are only truncations of information. Real information is not severed from other information. Information is a continuum—or as I hypothesize in my cosmological model (see comments under wave genome), it is an ordering principle. It has a time, location and (as blockchain purports to have), a heritage. I’d like to say (though I am unable), it has a destiny, which is really just a heritage in reverse. So, as I have repeatedly said (and Harry affirms), there really isn’t artificial intelligence, per se. Tons of really awesome machines, but they are always finite.

   Let me riff on that one a bit more. I do imagine that readers find my invocation of Eternity uncomfortably near to religiosity. But it truly isn’t! Eternity simply is. Our heritage is limitless. Invented things can be said to have a heritage, through the minds of living things, but ONLY through them. They may have an infinite future, but that infinity can never eclipse eternity. Thus, the machines can TRY, but Moore’s Law notwithstanding, the machine can never BE God, and if it could, then we should cast out the original One, as He would not be the Supreme Being.

   And that’s not even the damnation of The Machine, which is: all the cuttings on the floor it has left behind whilst digitizing everything leaves it woefully short of even the humblest sentience. Prof. DeGaris is anxious to leave behind the stultifying uniformity and want of creativity that is the net of what he sees in the regimented society that is China. Thus it will be with machines, limited as they are by their gears and detents. Harry brilliantly challenges (twice) whether machines are able to knowingly make mistakes. Now, of course, a random number generator (which isn’t really random at an infinite projection) could be inserted somewhere in a machine’s code to give it a wild hair once in a while, but it had to be programmed in the first place, so it would be an imperfect approximation of a mistake (cf. “I thought I made a mistake one time, but I was wrong.”).

   Last, in the interest of brevity, DeGaris seems to make another fundamental error that I think Harry may have overlooked, and that is the anthropomorphization of artificial intelligence, or worse, the imagined raising of one’s self to the intellectual height of what might be technically possible. If a human, who has had all the chipped teeth and skinned knees of living was suddenly imbued with “godlike” intellect and capabilities, yes, he just might do great evil, such as create an artilect war. If on the other hand, an actual intelligence was to be wrought, it would not have the petty grievances that its makers might have accrued. That is, an actually intelligent machine would have, it seems, wisdom. It would know that there is something about these stupid 10^16 mbps carbon dioxide makers that was able to create the likes of such a grand machine without a blueprint, and wish to preserve them. However, as Harry correctly points out, unintelligent, but awesome machines can and already are, wreaking havoc. CERN, HAARP, chemtrails and spyware, everywhere. They are at once stupid and fearsome. German military chief General von Manstein might have foreseen the disastrous potential that these two traits conjoined have, like he did with “hardworking and stupid.”

   Thought-provoking as always.

   1. John:

      I agree on the limitations of AI. I believe however AI will be used/is being used to front for something much more diabolical. And its processing speeds will be highly destructive to real intelligence. Examples abound already.

      Catherine

      1. Catherine,

         I could only conjecture as to what diabolical intents lie behind AI, but it is clear that we are taken into reliance on machines more and more, to the detriment of our own mental acuity. We should be able to do math in our heads, but what was once a commonplace is now almost vanished. The online reference we all can access is great, but it’s a limited set of ‘approved’ information. It takes real minds with emotional ties to memory for those to be living things. Once we debase the memory of the past (e.g. Confederate statues), we no longer ask about it. When we don’t ask, it doesn’t exist. When it doesn’t exist, history can be any old made-up thing. Values, needless to say are based on history. Where will we anchor our vessels when the ports to the past are washed away?

         1. My guess is that the vast amount of our history and available artifacts have been hidden or destroyed. People with no history are court off from their field – their own mind. it is like a tribal memory wipe. That is what I felt when I stood on Attila in the Outbck – like I got part of my mind back.

            1. Guess I limned the foul moods of the privileged students at UNC, who have proceeded to declare their zest for personal ignorance, even as mom and dad (and taxpayers) afford the luxury of their heedless destruction. The history of the college is what it is and with only a little thought, a considerate person (not a screeching mob) would apprehend that change has come to the place, which wouldn’t even be there without the kind of person whose statue was destroyed.

            2. John:

               How much of what happened was the result of covert ops and entrainment technology – aka Kingsman? The mind control technology is much stronger than you may think. Will be covering that topic for the next two weeks on the Solari Report.

               Remember – the top guys can not afford for an integration of right and left to happen. So extreme measures are called for to keep the game going.

            3. The fire of the library of Alexandria destroyed the ancient world documents. Would the world be different if there was no destruction to this library? Probably so.

            4. My guess is that some was stolen/saved. Would not be surprised if some was in the Vatican library.

7. Wow! Mr. Blazer, Ms. Fitts and Solari Team: Beautiful video addition. Hopefully one day this shorter video can me made to the public. This says it all in a non-confrontational, fear or hope porny way…which can be shown to family, friends etc who may not be aware of these ‘programs of control’ coming at us all at lightning speed. I feel blessed and grateful to be a part of Solari. Thank you all for what you DO for Humanity and ALL Life on Earth and Beyond.

8. Dear Harry,

   Thank for bringing the human dimension into the conversation. The actual word that would have cleared everything up is ‘soul’. A dirty word for scientists of the numeric persuasion.

   The issue at-bat is that this is a Newtonian scientist. The world and humans are only machines. Consciousness is an outcome, a result of the mechanics of the brain. Yet the majority of mathematical and scientific discoveries arrived in the minds of scientists through other means of consciousness that cannot be measured by the limited intellect of such scientists. For example, dreams, intuitions, and synchronicities. When the world is a physical nail you only use a hammer but if the world is a relationship existing on many levels of experience you need to listen.

   These are aspects of the human experience that you championed. Thank you for educating this gentleman. I hear so much of this AI hype and it always gets down to ‘we can take over the world with our machines” but only on paper. Only through calculations NOT through creativity. Arrogance and hubris. Can this gentleman build a house? I highly doubt nor could he solve the issues related to building such a house. Yet myself and other do this task daily even with ‘low’ IQ’s.

   You may want to look at an incredible book by J.Gary Sparks AT THE HEART OF MATTER: Synchronicity and Jung’s Spiritual Testament – J. Gary Sparks …. Carl Jung and Nobel prize-winning physicist Wolfgang Pauli work on the theory of Synchronicity. This is where we truely are in the struggle for the new world. The unconscious and the conscious are one and thus matter is brought into being through consciousness BUT it requires a transcendent function. This is the spiritual aspect that the Newtonian world will not touch. Maybe cause it requires a different sort of intellectual and spiritual quotient.

   Gotta go. I am late for building a home for someone.
   Cheers
   Doug

   1. Doug:

      Make sure to watch Wave Genome that posts tonight. Dives right into the middle of this,

      Catherine

      1. Will do Catherine. Will you ever have a luncheon or dinner on the west coast of Canada? Even the north western US states? Dying to meet and talk with you and Joesph. Cheers
         Doug

         1. OK, sounds like I need to get to Vancouver. Alas, I can not persuade Joseph to fly.

            1. Yes Please… I am aware of Joseph’s desire for earth based travel… I can always travel some where to meet you both.
               Cheers
               Doug

   2. Doug,

      While the brain is clearly a mechanism, there is reason to believe the mind is non-local. AI based on brain will have a mind somewhat different than real intelligence. The fact that we can fail is fundamentally superior to error-free computing, from a creativity standpoint. In fact, I fancy that we actually might exist to explore that which cannot be reduced to the cold facts of probability. Hunches have no explanation in mechanisms. Therefore we have to create the temporal world to explore them.

      Cheers.

      1. Very important point –
         Thanks!

9. This interview pretty much outlines the frightening crossroads we’re at, it’s a war of cosmologies, of being human or not. I love how Harry managed to ground the conversation and even got the dear Dr. to say” Do you sometimes look at the stars at night?”

   1. 🙂

10. Hi Catherine and Harry, Great interview and response by Harry…the problem seems to be that AI has no heart and no sense of cherishing our connection with the natural world or each other. Wishing you both an abundance of rainbows!

11. Thank God for Harry! I was feeling pretty frustrated by Dr. Garis. His intelligence is not in question…his narrow scope is. I think he was surprised by Harry’s point of view and passion.

    1. I think many experts live in a narrow scope – great effort is made to prevent integration. The thought of faster processing in a narrow scope is frightening. If anything it would make the system stupider and less diverse.

12. This is a dark interview…. Probably one of your darkest.

    I need breaks to digest the information.

    1. Yup. Intense.

13. I almost fell off my chair when I saw “The Artilect War” in an upcoming interview. I’ve turned so many horrified clients at my hair salon onto his book and YouTube interviews over the years, can’t wait to hear this ! Thank you!

    1. Oh, good! I found it to be a fascinating discussion.

14. Battlestar Galactica: 12 colonies = 12 tribes = 12 lines of the Cosmic Clock. I’ve heard there were robot wars on Mercury, fostered by fallen angels to be used against the Sons of God and Lightbearers. I think that those wars ended in a stalemate. Robots that were biological in nature without souls for the specific purpose of taking control of the planet. Creators of mechanization man who have sown in them seeds of evil, where the machine crosses over to become the biological mechanization man. Seems to me that those wars just moved to Earth, where it’s being played out today.

15. What will kill humanity off?
    AI or geoengineering? Both are fast growing and misused.
    After the planet is about dead one needs lots of AI build in your body to even semblance something living on our devastated planet.

    Sometimes I wonder how much humans are left, most seem just empty packages.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?list=PLwfFtDFZDpwtijqkJiOyc-WJOaGWOfVGG&v=2OaodxIsXJI

    Looking forward to this interview.

    1. I also need to digest the information but it seems a lot of those high IQ guys are brainwashed to use their IQ in a very narrow broadband. No wonder the world is in a not so humane situation since being human is much more then IQ points on a scale. Using speed on accumulated knowledge can only make a very poor semblance of a human being with only dangerous and temporary advantages for humanity.
       Have to listen to it again.

       1. Yes. This issue of speed vs. integration is really clear. If you listened to next week’s Solari Report the Wave Genome it helps flush this out. Our brains are not software and our bodies are not hardware. The whole paradigm being promoted is nuts and not in accord with how intelligence works.

16. I look forward to this one, and am curious to know on what basis he posits (as seems to emerge from the teaser) self-awareness in these artificial creations (and to have self-awareness you need a self to be aware of…).

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